So this post is for my cousin Allison. My last post in The Dog Whisperer I talked about a white German Shephard named Puppy and how HUGE he was and how I think he might be a wolf hybrid mix like his brother. Allison later messaged me and explained how white German Shephards are bigger than the more popular black and tan. It's very hard to tell because white German Shephards are disqualified so there isn't anything about how they are bigger than black and tan shephards so we're just going to have to take it from my cousin's expertise. So I promised I would take a picture next to him so she could see
According to AKC the standard, The desired height for males at the top of the highest point of the shoulder blade is 24 to 26 inches.
To me, it looks like the highest point of his ear (well the one that stands up) comes up to just above my belly button. But more importantly it seems that the highest point of Puppy's shoulder comes up to the lowest line on my shorts (Look closely).
I double checked and measured how many inches it is from the floor to the bottom line on my shorts and this is what I got:
My conclusion so far: I know puppy is taller than the larger of the AKC standard German Shephard standard (4 inches taller to be precise) and just bigger overall.
The next question to ask is: How much bigger are white German Shepards than the Black and Tan German shephards? (as per Allison's expertise)
The next question to ask is: How much bigger are white German Shepards than the Black and Tan German shephards? (as per Allison's expertise)
Are they really a whole 4 inches taller?
After a little bit of research on the web, I have learned that there are different types of German Shephards that are bred. Kind of the the English and American Bred Labrador Retrievers. This is fascinating!
Here is some information about the different lines of German Shepherds:
International working line- The German Shepherd is bred mainly to gain the working traits rather the looks. Because of this, the appearance of these dogs might differ.
International show line- This line was designed for breeders who are after the appearance of the dog rather than it’s working traits.
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North American show line- This line was also designed more for the looks of the dog but with certain variations. These include sloped backs and shaper angulations. There are now debates on whether this line should be considered as a different breed altogether. The breeders of this line argue that though there are great changes in the appearance of the dog, the working attributes have not been changed.
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Old-style German Shepherd. The goal for breeders of this line, is to simply bring back the German Shepherd dog to the way it was before. They aim to produce a line of GSD that looks and acts the same as its first ancestors. The old-style German Shepherd differs from the regular German Shepherd simply by its sheer size. The newer GSD is around 24-26 inches tall. The old style German Shepherd dwarfs them by four or more inches. An old-style German shepherd is about 30-33" in height and weighs around 110- 140lbs. The features on the face are the same with regular German Shepherds, but the old-style dogs have larger heads, straight backs, big bones and no extreme angulations on the legs, giving it a noble and more poised look.
My First Discovery
Puppy is an Old Style German Shepard.
Now that I figured out why Puppy was so large, I couldn't help but remember what my cousin said about how White German Shepards are bigger than black and tan shepards. So to come full circle, I asked myself the following question:
Why are White German Shephards larger than Black and Tan German Shephards?
North American show line- This line was also designed more for the looks of the dog but with certain variations. These include sloped backs and shaper angulations. There are now debates on whether this line should be considered as a different breed altogether. The breeders of this line argue that though there are great changes in the appearance of the dog, the working attributes have not been changed.
Old-style German Shepherd. The goal for breeders of this line, is to simply bring back the German Shepherd dog to the way it was before. They aim to produce a line of GSD that looks and acts the same as its first ancestors. The old-style German Shepherd differs from the regular German Shepherd simply by its sheer size. The newer GSD is around 24-26 inches tall. The old style German Shepherd dwarfs them by four or more inches. An old-style German shepherd is about 30-33" in height and weighs around 110- 140lbs. The features on the face are the same with regular German Shepherds, but the old-style dogs have larger heads, straight backs, big bones and no extreme angulations on the legs, giving it a noble and more poised look.
My First Discovery
Puppy is an Old Style German Shepard.
Now that I figured out why Puppy was so large, I couldn't help but remember what my cousin said about how White German Shepards are bigger than black and tan shepards. So to come full circle, I asked myself the following question:
Why are White German Shephards larger than Black and Tan German Shephards?
What I Found:
Based on the AKC standards and basic genetic knowlege, think it is fair to say that white German Shephards are larger because AKC does not recognize the white and breeders make sure that their bitches and studs do not both carry that recess gene when breeding so that that they do not increase the chances of having any of the "undesirable" white.
Based on the AKC standards and basic genetic knowlege, think it is fair to say that white German Shephards are larger because AKC does not recognize the white and breeders make sure that their bitches and studs do not both carry that recess gene when breeding so that that they do not increase the chances of having any of the "undesirable" white.
My Conclusion
It's not that White German Shephards are larger than black and tans. It's that Black and tans are actually smaller than whites. It is clear that White German Shephards have more conentrated old style phenotypes compared to the diluted black and tans.
It's not that White German Shephards are larger than black and tans. It's that Black and tans are actually smaller than whites. It is clear that White German Shephards have more conentrated old style phenotypes compared to the diluted black and tans.
My Reflection
It is so scary how much a breed can change by adding more "desirable" traits and breeding out the "undesireable" traits. We had a yellow lab puppy the other day with amber eyes. Unfortunetly in the process of adding and subtracting, things I have started to see some funky looking labs. One time I saw a yellow lab puppy in a pet store with BLUE eyes. BLUE EYES! The second I layed eyes on him, my stomach sank. it is SO sad to see. I don't know enough the GSD as well as I know the Labrador, but I wonder if some GSD experts think that GSDs are "inbred". Not in because they have amber or blue eyes, or are weird looking, but because they have strayed SO far from the Old-style. So much so thay it could be considered a separate breed in itself. If you think about it, the labrador and the chesapeak bay retriever look almost identical. Very different in terms of their personality, but are very separate breeds none-the-less. I think that the AKC should consider White German Shephards as a separate breed. They could be called the Old German Shephard. This would make the White Shephard fans happy because they would finally be in the AKC, while keeping the die hard black and tan lover happy by creating a separate breed.
It is so scary how much a breed can change by adding more "desirable" traits and breeding out the "undesireable" traits. We had a yellow lab puppy the other day with amber eyes. Unfortunetly in the process of adding and subtracting, things I have started to see some funky looking labs. One time I saw a yellow lab puppy in a pet store with BLUE eyes. BLUE EYES! The second I layed eyes on him, my stomach sank. it is SO sad to see. I don't know enough the GSD as well as I know the Labrador, but I wonder if some GSD experts think that GSDs are "inbred". Not in because they have amber or blue eyes, or are weird looking, but because they have strayed SO far from the Old-style. So much so thay it could be considered a separate breed in itself. If you think about it, the labrador and the chesapeak bay retriever look almost identical. Very different in terms of their personality, but are very separate breeds none-the-less. I think that the AKC should consider White German Shephards as a separate breed. They could be called the Old German Shephard. This would make the White Shephard fans happy because they would finally be in the AKC, while keeping the die hard black and tan lover happy by creating a separate breed.
Thanks to Paradis Creek German Shepards
Hey love!
ReplyDeleteThese are mostly color variations of the same breed. And yes, there are certainly different "lines," but they're all the same breed. The only thing that makes a breed a "breed" is that the dogs have a documented lineage and adhere to specific standard or breed "type." Because the whites don't fit the breed standard they are excluded from being labeled as such.
Most of the GSD show lines are crap. The dogs suffer so terribly from inbreeding/genetic disease and poor body build (those angles and roached backs cause major musculoskelatal problems). Breeders will deny this vehemently, but all you need to do is some basic research to find that they go to great lengths to cover up issues in their dogs or deny them completely. The show dogs' conformation is so terrible they would not be able to hack it as working dogs, period. Some of them can't even walk correctly because of the angulation in their hocks. Pretty sad.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3O0l0f50AAk